Interview conducted by Eric van de Beek
At the age of 100, former Prime Minister of Malaysia Dr. Tun Mahathir Mohamad is still politically active. He keeps a weblog and shares his political views with journalists on a regular basis. When he took office for a second term in 2018, he had to deal with the aftermath of two events that had plunged the nation into mourning: the loss of all crew members and passengers of two Malaysia Airlines Boeing aircraft in 2014. Mahathir holds strong opinions about the cause of these disasters. “MH370 was probably brought down by the Americans.” And: “Why blame Russia and not Russians living in Ukraine for the downing of MH17?” Although critical of Malaysia’s current government, Mahathir praises the investments that are made in the development of the country. “Malaysia believes in peace. We don’t think wars will solve any problem. Malaysia spends only 3 percent of its budget on the military. 60 percent on education. That is our priority.”
In 2014 Malaysia Airlines lost two passenger planes. On March 8, flight MH370 went missing on its way from Kuala Lumpur to Beijing. Investigators found that less than an hour after the departure of the Boeing, its communications systems were turned off. Military radar then revealed the aircraft had turned back across Malaysia, skirted the island of Penang, and headed towards the northern tip of Sumatra.
Some 26 countries joined the search and rescue mission that followed the disappearance, but could find nothing. On July 17, flight MH17, which had departed from Amsterdam and was heading towards Kuala Lumpur, was shot down over Eastern Ukraine, where at that time a war was raging between the Ukrainian army and pro-Russian insurgents. The criminal investigation into the downing of the Boeing was led by a team of Dutch, Belgian, Australian, Ukrainian and Malaysian police officers and prosecutors – the Joint Investigation Team (JIT). In 2016 the JIT concluded that MH17 was downed from rebel-held territory by a Buk air defence system from Russia.
In 2022 the The Hague District court sentenced two Russians and one Ukrainian for having ordered and transported the Buk. The main culprits, those who shot down the plane, are still at large. The JIT assumes they are hiding in circles of the 53rd anti-aircraft brigade in Kursk, Russia. A Buk from that brigade allegedly crossed the border into Ukraine with crew on July 17, 2014, where it fired the fatal missile the same day. However, the JIT admitted that it had failed to identify those who pulled the trigger and gave the shooting order. It also admitted that it did not know why the plane was shot down.
In 2023 the JIT announced that it had halted the investigation. In 2025 the European Court of Human Rights (ECHR) passed judgment. Unlike the District Court of The Hague, the ECHR stated that it did not know whether a Russian crew had fired the fatal missile. It could also have been pro-Russian insurgents. However, the ECHR considered this irrelevant. According to the ECHR, the fatal missile was launched from an area in eastern Ukraine controlled by pro-Russian insurgents. Because the ECHR was convinced that these were directly controlled from Russia, it held the Russian state responsible for the disaster.
Dr. Mahathir Mohamad was Prime Minister of Malaysia from 1981 to 2003 and again from 2018 to 2020. Critical statements that he made about the JIT investigation caused some turmoil, especially among family members of the 196 Dutch victims of the MH17 crash. Mahathir ended his last term as Prime Minister when he was 94. In 2022 he lost his seat in Parliament. At the age of 100 he still lives an active life. He keeps himself informed on a daily basis about developments in Malaysia and abroad, and shares his opinions via his weblog thechedet.com. We met with him in his office at the Perdana Foundation in Putrajjaya. the administrative centre of Malaysia.
In 2019, when you were Prime Minister, you criticised the official investigation into the crash. “We see too much politics in it ,” you said. “The idea was not to find out how this happened but seemed to be concentrated on trying to pin it to the Russians.” You made this statement before the MH17 trial had started in the Netherlands and the District Court of The Haghe had reached a verdict. Do you still hold the same opinion or did you change your mind?
During the Second World War, Russia and the Western nations worked together to defeat Germany. But the moment Germany was defeated, then the Western nations decided that the new enemy is Russia. And since then, the opinion about Russia is biased. When you have a court that is obviously manned by people who are actually against Russia, their findings cannot be accepted easily.
So you didn’t change your mind after the Dutch court in 2022 reached a verdict about MH17?
I don’t think it was the Russians who shot down the plane. Shooting down a passenger plane belonging to Malaysia is not something that Russia would do. The missile may have been produced in Russia, but the people who operated the weapon were Russians who lived in Ukraine. You can’t blame Russia for that. You sell weapons to other countries, and if those countries use these weapons, normally you are not blamed. And sometimes mistakes are made. We know that the Americans, for example, shot down an Iranian passenger plane. They claimed that it was a mistake. Why blame Russia and not Russians living in Ukraine for the downing of MH17?
In 2020, at a press conference, you questioned the 9/11 attacks in the United States. You said there was strong evidence they were staged. Do you think MH17 could have been a false flag too?
In the case of the Twin Towers, we note that there was a third tower which was also brought down. The third tower was not hit by any plane. And yet it collapsed just like the other two towers Then there was this plane that was supposed to have hit the Pentagon… We didn’t see any trace of the plane, only pictures of the destruction of parts of the Pentagon.
Also, to plan the seizure of four airplanes at the same time and to fly them to hit the Twin Towers… Arabs are not very good at planning such a major complicated operation. The evidence does not show clearly that this was a planned attack by the Arabs.
A Dutch foundation of the family members of the MH17 victims sent you a letter. They accused you of spreading doubt about the investigation of the JIT. Did you respond to their letter?
No. I still maintain that the investigation should have been done by a third party. Certainly, if any findings are put before a court, it must be a court that is not in any way linked to nations making claims over what happened to the plane.
Is this your message to the family members of the victims, or do you have something to add to this?
No, they are entitled to make claims. But they must make claims against the people who actually shot down the plane. It was not Russia. It is more likely to be Russians living in Ukraine.
Your critical remarks about the JIT were at odds with the comments of the Malaysian prosecutor Muhammad Hanafiah bin Zakaria. At a press conference in 2019, he told reporters that the findings were based on extensive investigations and legal research. “We support the findings,” he said.
Whatever may be the Malaysian delegation’s stand, I still maintain that the research was done by people who from the very beginning wanted to implicate Russia and that the shooting down of that plane was done by Russians living in Ukraine.
Can you tell us something about the role Malaysia played in the JIT? Because we haven’t heard much about that in the Western press.
Well, they too may be biased. Because Malaysia, of course, is very pro-Western and against Russia.
There are no concrete things you’ve heard about the role Malaysia played in the criminal investigation?
No, I don’t put much faith in their impartiality. They should not have associated themselves with the European countries which set up the court to pass judgment over the incident.
What is the position of the current Malaysian government on MH17?
The current Malaysian government is not very popular in Malaysia. There are many things that this government has done which are not in favour of Malaysia. They are influenced in some way by America.
The current government supports the verdict of the Dutch court, you think?
Well, that is their stand. But it’s not necessary that everyone agrees with the government’s view.
What happened to flight MH370?
So far there has been no wreckage discovered of MH370. So this plane could have been hijacked by some people for some reason. What is known is that Boeing has the capacity to take over control of a plane in flight. Of course, they have to have some instruments installed. And I was told by a Japanese journalist that this plane has been hijacked. It had landed somewhere, and it may have been taken to pieces, or it may have been taken to other countries. If the plane had crashed, we should have found some evidence, some wreckage floating around. Very extensive searches have been conducted.
Do you think there could be a connection between the loss of MH17 and MH370?
No, I don’t think so, because MH370 was probably brought down by the Americans. I have seen a report long before this happened, a report that the US government had given Boeing the ability to bring down a plane which is flying. And it is very likely that the plane was taken over. To take over a plane and paralyse the whole system is very easy. You just cut off the oxygen supply and the pilots and passengers will all die. And the plane can then land somewhere. Whatever happened after that of course is anybody’s guess.
Have you anything to add to this interview?
Yes, I think when we want to pass judgment, don’t set up a court that is biased. For example, in the case of the Nuremberg Court on the Second World War, the people who were regarded as having committed war crimes, they were tried by a court set up by the victors. It should be a court that is not related to the victors or the losers. It should be an independent court. When the victors set up a court to try the losers, you cannot accept the findings.
We are living in a world that America wants to dominate. America has taken action that is against almost every country in the world. This has subverted the multipolar world. The Americans like wars, and because the Atlantic separates them from Europe, they would be okay with war in Europe.
Immediately after the defeat of Germany, the first thing that the Western nations did was to set up NATO. NATO is a military alliance that excluded Russia and regarded Russia as an enemy. But Russia was your partner before. Why do you have to have an enemy? Europeans must have an enemy at any time. And for the enemy, you have to prepare for war to defend yourself. In the end, you become aggressive. Compare this to China. We in Malaysia have lived with China for 2,000 years. We have never been conquered by them. The Portuguese came here in 1509. Two years later, they came with battleships, with armed merchantmen, and conquered Malacca, Malaysia. So the attitude is different. The Chinese do not conquer, but the Europeans conquer and colonise.
Malaysia believes in peace. We don’t think wars will solve any problem. Wars create problems at great cost. The whole country will be destroyed. So much money is spent now on weapons. This way you can’t concentrate on development. Malaysia spends only 3 percent of its budget on the military now. 60 percent on education. That is our priority.
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This interview with Dr. Tun Mahathir Mohamad took place on December 24, 2025. On January 6, 2026, he was admitted to the hospital after suffering a hip fracture following a fall at his residence. The centenarian fell while doing his normal morning exercise of brisk walking, according to Mahathir’s son, Mukhriz, who added that doctors ruled out surgery due to his age and therefore his recovery may take longer.
Eric van de Beek, who conducted the interview, wrote three books about the MH17 crash, among one published in English recently: The MH17 Trial – An analysis of all evidence presented
